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Fix for FallUI / Complex Item Sorter breaking SS2's Quests

Meep the Changeling

Meep the Changeling

New Member
Messages
26
I just learned that a lot of people don't know you can tell Mr8's Complex Sorter to skip certain records when sorting. This is a bad thing since Complex Sorter breaks a few of Sim Settlement's quests (sometimes) via doing what it does, renaming records so they sort into FallUI's categories correctly. Here is all of the lines you need to make a pair of ini files which instruct Complex Sorter to skip every single kind of record within Fallout 4's engine for Sim Settlements chapter 1 and 2. Copy pasta the lines from this forum into notepad and save them as 2 ini, one named "SS2.ini" and another named "SS2_XPAC_Chapter2.ini". You'll want to place them in "<Fallout 4 Install dir>\Edit Scripts\M8r Complex Item Sorter\Rules (User)". These inis will ensure that the Sorter ignores everything from those plugins, and as a consequence, no weapons, clothing, armor, holotapes, etc added by SS2 will be tagged and thus will not sort... But your quests will work. If someone can explain to me what items specifically cannot be touched from these mods or it will break a quest, I believe I can make an ini that will skip sorting JUST those specific records.

If you think it might be a good idea to make sure that Complex Sorter doesn't touch a single mod relating to SS2, simply copy the contents of these ini files and make new ini files with names identical to the esp/esm/esl you want CS to ignore.

[ACHR]
*=IGNORE
[ACRE]
*=IGNORE
[ACTI]
*=IGNORE
[ADDN]
*=IGNORE
[ALCH]
*=IGNORE
[ALOC]
*=IGNORE
[AMEF]
*=IGNORE
[AMMO]
*=IGNORE
[ANIO]
*=IGNORE
[ARMA]
*=IGNORE
[ARMO]
*=IGNORE
[ASPC]
*=IGNORE
[AVIF]
*=IGNORE
[BOOK]
*=IGNORE
[BPTD]
*=IGNORE
[CAMS]
*=IGNORE
[CCRD]
*=IGNORE
[CDCK]
*=IGNORE
[CELL]
*=IGNORE
[CHAL]
*=IGNORE
[CHIP]
*=IGNORE
[CLAS]
*=IGNORE
[CLMT]
*=IGNORE
[CMNY]
*=IGNORE
[CONT]
*=IGNORE
[CPTH]
*=IGNORE
[CREA]
*=IGNORE
[CSNO]
*=IGNORE
[CSTY]
*=IGNORE
[DEBR]
*=IGNORE
[DEHY]
*=IGNORE
[DIAL]
*=IGNORE
[DOBJ]
*=IGNORE
[DOOR]
*=IGNORE
[ECZN]
*=IGNORE
[EFSH]
*=IGNORE
[ENCH]
*=IGNORE
[EXPL]
*=IGNORE
[EYES]
*=IGNORE
[FACT]
*=IGNORE
[FLST]
*=IGNORE
[FURN]
*=IGNORE
[GLOB]
*=IGNORE
[GMST]
*=IGNORE
[GRAS]
*=IGNORE
[GRUP]
*=IGNORE
[HAIR]
*=IGNORE
[HDPT]
*=IGNORE
[HUNG]
*=IGNORE
[IDLE]
*=IGNORE
[IDLM]
*=IGNORE
[IMAD]
*=IGNORE
[IMGS]
*=IGNORE
[IMOD]
*=IGNORE
[INFO]
*=IGNORE
[INGR]
*=IGNORE
[IPCT]
*=IGNORE
[IPDS]
*=IGNORE
[KEYM]
*=IGNORE
[LAND]
*=IGNORE
[LGTM]
*=IGNORE
[LIGH]
*=IGNORE
[LSCR]
*=IGNORE
[LSCT]
*=IGNORE
[LTEX]
*=IGNORE
[LVLC]
*=IGNORE
[LVLI]
*=IGNORE
[LVLN]
*=IGNORE
[MAPM]
*=IGNORE
[MESG]
*=IGNORE
[MGEF]
*=IGNORE
[MICN]
*=IGNORE
[MISC]
*=IGNORE
[MSET]
*=IGNORE
[MSTT]
*=IGNORE
[MUSC]
*=IGNORE
[NAVI]
*=IGNORE
[NAVM]
*=IGNORE
[NOTE]
*=IGNORE
[NPC_]
*=IGNORE
[PACK]
*=IGNORE
[PERK]
*=IGNORE
[PGRE]
*=IGNORE
[PMIS]
*=IGNORE
[PROJ]
*=IGNORE
[PWAT]
*=IGNORE
[QUST]
*=IGNORE
[RACE]
*=IGNORE
[RADS]
*=IGNORE
[RCCT]
*=IGNORE
[RCPE]
*=IGNORE
[REFR]
*=IGNORE
[REGN]
*=IGNORE
[REPU]
*=IGNORE
[RGDL]
*=IGNORE
[SCOL]
*=IGNORE
[SCPT]
*=IGNORE
[SLPD]
*=IGNORE
[SOUN]
*=IGNORE
[SPEL]
*=IGNORE
[STAT]
*=IGNORE
[TACT]
*=IGNORE
[TERM]
*=IGNORE
[TES4]
*=IGNORE
[TREE]
*=IGNORE
[TXST]
*=IGNORE
[VTYP]
*=IGNORE
[WATR]
*=IGNORE
[WEAP]
*=IGNORE
[WRLD]
*=IGNORE
[WTHR]
*=IGNORE
 
Specifically, which quests does it break? Be curious to know which ones exactly as I've never noticed this behavior and I use complex sorter patches.
 
Yeah I hope someone can figure out which things need to be excluded specifically, because I want to keep as many things tagged as possible.
 
eldiablo said:
Specifically, which quests does it break? Be curious to know which ones exactly as I've never noticed this behavior and I use complex sorter patches.
Click to expand...
It breaks the one where you go into the Vault Tech basement in some odd ways... but only sometimes. The modmakers have said that it's specificly using item sorting mods like Complex Sorter. IDK why.


somnambulist said:
M8r's got a SS2 ruleset that supposedly excludes the affected quests. Grab the ruleset from the optional files -- you don't need/want the ESP if you're building your own sorting patch.
www.nexusmods.com

Sim Settlements 2 - FallUI Item Sorter patch

FallUI Item Sorter patch for Sim Settlements 2.
www.nexusmods.com www.nexusmods.com
Click to expand...
Good to know, thanks!
 
Meep the Changeling said:
It breaks the one where you go into the Vault Tech basement in some odd ways... but only sometimes. The modmakers have said that it's specificly using item sorting mods like Complex Sorter. IDK why.



Good to know, thanks!
Click to expand...
Very strange. Never had issues with that mission, even with sorter patches. Good ol'buggy fallout.
 
somnambulist said:
M8r's got a SS2 ruleset that supposedly excludes the affected quests. Grab the ruleset from the optional files -- you don't need/want the ESP if you're building your own sorting patch.
www.nexusmods.com

Sim Settlements 2 - FallUI Item Sorter patch

FallUI Item Sorter patch for Sim Settlements 2.
www.nexusmods.com www.nexusmods.com
Click to expand...
This. Even if you make your own complex sorter you should download the ruleset. It says it is going to be included in the next CS release, but there has not been a release since this optional file was released.
 
The other thing you can do is just globally disable quest tagging for all mods — means you'll lose icon tags next to quests if you're running FallUI but, meh.
 
Another followup -- if you want to keep Complex Sorter from tagging building and city plans, put the following in FO4Edit/Edit Scripts/M8r Complex Item Sorter/Rules (User)/rules-processing.ini

Code: 
[prefilter:WEAP]
KEYWORDS contains SS2_Tag_BuildingPlan = IGNORE
KEYWORDS contains SS2_Tag_LevelPlan = IGNORE
 
Bit of a necro on this thread, but I'm having an issue with this myself ATM for Ch3, specifically the "Black King, White Knight" quest. Is it possible to make changes to your sorter plugin or ini's in the middle of a save to try and fix this? I know my complex sorter patch is the problem with the CTD, I also know if I disable the sorter plugin and finish the dialogue then re-enable it, I can get past the specific crash, but I'm worried about the implications that could have for my save file. Does anybody with any knowledge surrounding these things have any pointers?
 
NapsIsSleepy said:
Bit of a necro on this thread, but I'm having an issue with this myself ATM for Ch3, specifically the "Black King, White Knight" quest. Is it possible to make changes to your sorter plugin or ini's in the middle of a save to try and fix this? I know my complex sorter patch is the problem with the CTD, I also know if I disable the sorter plugin and finish the dialogue then re-enable it, I can get past the specific crash, but I'm worried about the implications that could have for my save file. Does anybody with any knowledge surrounding these things have any pointers?
Click to expand...
I also experienced CTD in SS2C3 because of CS quest tags (looking at buffout and log scanner result). CMIIW I think it is safe to update your CS esp and remove the quest tagging for those that causes CTD (in my case, it was some of C3 quest). As far as I can see, the default prefilter for CS quest tags haven't include SS2C3 so I tried to made it myself, but it is a blanket solution for all SS2C3 quest (exclude all quest from tagging). Once again, I myself am not too savvy with CS so I let others who knew better reply on me.
 
Having issue with Black King/White Knight crashing as well and Buffout 4 crash long points to SS2C3 and M8r’s Complex Sorter. Will try generating a new complex sorter patch with quest tagging disabled. It’s possible m8r might need to update their SS2 quest tags if they haven’t already since CH 3’s release.
 
I have not had any luck with getting past this CTD, even after disabling the plug-in and disabling quest-tagging. Here is my crash log.
 

Attachments

  • crash-2023-10-09-03-42-10.log
    24.7 KB · Views: 6
hobinguli said:
As far as I can see, the default prefilter for CS quest tags haven't include SS2C3 so I tried to made it myself, but it is a blanket solution for all SS2C3 quest (exclude all quest from tagging).
Click to expand...

I've basically taken the "nuke it from orbit" approach and have my exclusions lists setup so the only things that get tagged are things that can exist in the player's inventory. Decided to take action after Complex Sorter had to generate TWO plugins to hold all the tagging data. If you poke around in Xedit can see how SS2 reuses forms outside their intended purpose. CS does its best to exclude non-usable items — it does do a decent job but still includes hundreds of records that exist to implement SS2's mechanics. (This isn't a problem with CS; it rightfully assumes that a an ARMO record is for something that is worn, not a theme for a building plan or whatever.)

Edit: Putting this in "Rules (User)\rules-processing.ini" should keep Complex Sorter from tagging any SS2 quest.

Code: 
[prefilter:QUEST]
EDID contains "SS2"
 
Last edited:
UPDATE: So, I finally got past the CTD.
None of the workaround worked for me. Rebuilding my patch without quest tagging? Nope.
Rebuilding the patch while excluding the SS2 + Chapter Pack esms? Nope.
Creating User rules for SS2 and Chapter Packs esms with the instructions provided above to force CIS to exclude them? Nope.

The ONLY way that I could get past the CTD in the quest, Black King, White Knight, was to full-on disable both CIS SS2 patch AND my custom CIS SS2 patch override.

Why do I have both? Because when I initially made the mod list, the SS2 rules were not integrated into CIS yet and I forgot to disable it when starting this latest playthrough.

So if you’re like me and have both CIS patches and haven’t managed to get past this CTD, you’ll unfortunately either have to skip to the next quest stage using console commands (I don’t believe the quest stages for Ch 3 are on the wiki as of now, but this might make a compelling argument to include them for at least THIS SPECIFIC QUEST if possible, @Cessori ), OR to compromise the integrity of your save file, disable both CIS patches, get through the dialogue, save, re-enable the CIS patches, and continue.

Hopefully this helps someone else in the future so they don’t sit on this CTD for a week like I did. ✌️
 
veelynnlove said:
OR to compromise the integrity of your save file, disable both CIS patches, get through the dialogue, save, re-enable the CIS patches, and continue.
Click to expand...
I don't think item names can corrupt your save. Their name is generated on loot or workbench modification, which will adhere to the current rule set. One thing to watch for is when you have item sorter patches that are out of date. This can result in a crash if the patch no longer aligns with the updated record in the main plugin (it used to happen to people using random patches on the Nexus that are not always up to date).

At any rate, you are past your crash, and with the CIS patches re-enabled, you should be fine :)
 
Publishing Quest IDs and Stages was discussed with the Devs, and it was decided not to include them for Chapter 3.

Why?
  • Chapter 3 has the most complex quest structures out of all of the SS2 Quests. Many of the quests are dependent on and intermingled with other quests.
  • Even entering the correct console command: setstage questID stage# does not always resolve the issue with the quest. There are scripts in the background that also run as well as some quests that call background quests that aren't visible to the player.
  • In addition, keeping "stages" up to date and accurate for Chapter 3 quests is not feasible right now, since those quests are being updated. When ever the quest is updated to fix something, the stages can and often do change. There have also been recent changes to Chapter 2 quests, which is why those quest stages are not currently published.
  • You can get the stages information by using a console command, sqo questID (Show Quest Objectives)
  • Until the quests stabilize, quest stages will not be published to the Wiki.

For any reading:
  • We don't recommend using console commands to force your way through quests because some stages should not be set for your game.
  • Even those console commands that others post as the solution to a quest issue, may not be the right solution for your game.
  • If a dev posts a console command to use for a situation, that console command is only good for the exact situation being discussed. It may not work for your game.
  • Using console commands to setstage can break your game. If you are going to use them, be sure to make a save before you do so.
 
veelynnlove said:
UPDATE: So, I finally got past the CTD.
None of the workaround worked for me. Rebuilding my patch without quest tagging? Nope.
Rebuilding the patch while excluding the SS2 + Chapter Pack esms? Nope.
Creating User rules for SS2 and Chapter Packs esms with the instructions provided above to force CIS to exclude them? Nope.

The ONLY way that I could get past the CTD in the quest, Black King, White Knight, was to full-on disable both CIS SS2 patch AND my custom CIS SS2 patch override.

Why do I have both? Because when I initially made the mod list, the SS2 rules were not integrated into CIS yet and I forgot to disable it when starting this latest playthrough.

So if you’re like me and have both CIS patches and haven’t managed to get past this CTD, you’ll unfortunately either have to skip to the next quest stage using console commands (I don’t believe the quest stages for Ch 3 are on the wiki as of now, but this might make a compelling argument to include them for at least THIS SPECIFIC QUEST if possible, @Cessori ), OR to compromise the integrity of your save file, disable both CIS patches, get through the dialogue, save, re-enable the CIS patches, and continue.

Hopefully this helps someone else in the future so they don’t sit on this CTD for a week like I did. ✌️
Click to expand...
Happy that you made it :)
 
Alright, time for a second post.

I have confirmed in my own save that CIS breaks a particular quest route for the NLTC quest “Espionage.” This is the “triple cross” route. I had to do another full-on disable of both of my CIS patches in order for the dialogue
where you inform Lydia that Glatton knows about her movements
to appear. Otherwise, the dialogue does not appear, locking the player out of that route.

At this point, are we still hoping that M8r updates CIS for SS2 compatibility? Is there anyone in the community more knowledgeable about CIS sorting that could investigate this further and figure out how to create sorting rules for CH 3? I’m feeling pretty wary about re-enabling CIS at all with how incompatible it’s been with the CH 3 quest lines so far, but I would really rather not break my save OR abandon item sorting altogether…

…help?
 
Cessori said:
Publishing Quest IDs and Stages was discussed with the Devs, and it was decided not to include them for Chapter 3.

Why?
  • Chapter 3 has the most complex quest structures out of all of the SS2 Quests. Many of the quests are dependent on and intermingled with other quests.
  • Even entering the correct console command: setstage questID stage# does not always resolve the issue with the quest. There are scripts in the background that also run as well as some quests that call background quests that aren't visible to the player.
  • In addition, keeping "stages" up to date and accurate for Chapter 3 quests is not feasible right now, since those quests are being updated. When ever the quest is updated to fix something, the stages can and often do change. There have also been recent changes to Chapter 2 quests, which is why those quest stages are not currently published.
  • You can get the stages information by using a console command, sqo questID (Show Quest Objectives)
  • Until the quests stabilize, quest stages will not be published to the Wiki.

For any reading:
  • We don't recommend using console commands to force your way through quests because some stages should not be set for your game.
  • Even those console commands that others post as the solution to a quest issue, may not be the right solution for your game.
  • If a dev posts a console command to use for a situation, that console command is only good for the exact situation being discussed. It may not work for your game.
  • Using console commands to setstage can break your game. If you are going to use them, be sure to make a save before you do so.
Click to expand...
Thank you so much for the thorough reply Cessori! Greatly appreciate you and your hard work!
 
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